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Zombie_fonzie

What does YOUR NWod cosmology look like?

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I know some of you might be against the idea of nailing down a definite cosmology in NWod, maybe because it takes away from the mystery, don't want to proclaim one splat right, ect. Forget that, Based on your reading of the books, play, or personal vision how do you see the various supernatural realms and hellscapes fitting together in your mind? Fate of the soul after death? What happens to a vampire if they reach Final Death? Use them all or use one, I don't care, just do it.

My personal theory is that the Promethean Principle and/or God Machine is the engine that powers and constructs the universe. The Supernal Realms are partially the condensed thoughts of the universe (which includes planets besides earth, meaning that there are other sentient species besides a derivative of humans, but they probably look and act mostly human. This is because of all consciousness being a splinter of the Divine Fire, but they are probably all dead because of Mage dickery), partially the Pyros condensing into a more base substance. The "lower half" of the universe is entirely moved by the actions and emotions of humans and other forms of life due to the tiny bit of Divine Fire that is in all life. The Hedge, Arcadia, and The Abyss are the result of humans who were able to awaken their inner spark (Mages) and through a massive fuck up broke the spine of the universe causing the previously enclosed universe to start to crack, causing the void beyond reality to seep in. This also destroyed the strands of Fate that had held to together (think of it as the muscle of the universe) to fray and snap leading to internal holes of form and allowing for the creation of Arcadia and the True Fae. These holes though also allowed direct access to raw Pyros, allowing for the creation of Prometheans. Mortals can usually do because while they may not know their inner spark well enough to consciously access it, their blindness to the rest of the world allows them to focus on what is the most important thing to them. This causes their own spark to momentary grow to super nova levels and calling down raw Pyros like a magnet. (as the book says "Azoth calls to Azoth")

When a vampire is turned they loose this spark and replaced with a major Abyssal entity known as the Beast aka Stryks, which due the fact that the Abyss is incapable of creation on its own, latched on to the most creative thing in the world, Mankind. I say this because when a vampire frenzies or drops to morality 0 they basically try to destroy all life around them, thought the way it does this is influence by the various flavors of vampire and echos of the human host.

Because of the natures of Pyros to create, if Prometheans could be mobilized they could be potent weapon against the Abyss.

Now regular ghosts do not loose their spark, but it is dimmed greatly and requires it to be renewed. This causes the ghost to become spiritually heavy and to sink down in the Underworld over time and if they don't taken out by one many other horrible thing down their they will eventually reach the Ocean( I forgot the exact name). They are then pulled down and slowly stripped of any personal markers like memory, personality, identity until it reaches the bottom. All that remains is a small conscious mote of Pyros that is then absorbed back into the God Machine and the process begins again.

That was all probably a bit rambley, but I'll give it a bit of editing later after I have had some sleep.

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I prefer to keep things very, very simple. People who try to figure out how the cosmology works go insane and/or die. The end.

The grand secret is that there are no answers. Just more shadows and darkness. The World of Darkness is certainly large enough to allow for zombies and Faerie and the Underword and the Gauntlet and Tammuz and the Empty Room and Strix and a myriad more things to exist, but there's no sane, rational explanation big enough to cover all these things.

You might find this depressing and sad. That's the whole point.

No reason to give the PCs any substantial information that will, in the end, break the whole mystery of the setting.

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Curator

I prefer to keep things very, very simple. People who try to figure out how the cosmology works go insane and/or die. The end.

The grand secret is that there are no answers. Just more shadows and darkness. The World of Darkness is certainly large enough to allow for zombies and Faerie and the Underword and the Gauntlet and Tammuz and the Empty Room and Strix and a myriad more things to exist, but there's no sane, rational explanation big enough to cover all these things.

You might find this depressing and sad. That's the whole point.

No reason to give the PCs any substantial information that will, in the end, break the whole mystery of the setting.

True enough, but I still prefer these interesting, cosmology-laden debates to blore's arguments about an abrahamic umbrood cain being the "only" reality. I will post more when I have decided how I wish to treat Demon the Fallen in nwod. And no, demons of vice from Inferno don't cut it compared to the fallen.

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Guest Oldestschool

While a player might never learn this and should never learn this, as it would in my estimation break the mystery of the game, one theoretical possibility lies in the arrangement of sub-dimensions.

Hell - Inside the earth - Some demons, truly dead morally negative spirits

Netherworld where ghosts live - between hell and earth - ghosts still connected to earth

Earth - The physical plane itself

Astral - between abyss and earth - Mummies, morally positive truly dead spirits

Abyss - between astral and outer darkness - demons, some cthonians, souls of morally negative wizards

Outer darkness - everywhere else, cthonians

Of course its not so excessively simple as I've made it here, there are many mysteries to the world as I see it, and not all of them need be explained or can be explained. Where did this arrangement come from? How many more dimensions are there that we haven't reached? Does anything rule the cosmos intelligently? Are the blind forces which grind continuously in motion across the cosmos the only forces there are? None of these questions can or should be answered.

The greatest horror of all time is the imputation that there is NO MEANING whatsoever to the universe and that it is simply a collection of inexplicable processes, some understood, some not, that grinds blindly on obliviously and doesn't care what your feelings on the matter are. This is also a great form of personal liberation, because if this is the case you can live as you chose to live without fear of punishment, though also without the hope of any reward but what you earn yourself. Sartre, Kirkegaard, Nietszche, Camus and others are worth reading if you seek to create this sort of mood.

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Actually, the Lutheran Church-Missouri Synod isn't really all that "out there." It's actually mainstream Christian, and SKeLoRiC's (notably cynical) viewpoint isn't the viewpoint of the LCMS.

Admittedly, the LCMS is one of the more CONSERVATIVE denominations of Christianity out there (last I'd checked, they still weren't ordaining women or homosexuals, unlike the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America), but they do believe in a loving, forgiving God who ultimately looks at faith rather than good works.

Now, after that brief deviation from the REAL topic...

In MY World of Darkness, the world is in the Biblical "End Times," with no definitive end in sight. Those who do right by others, love their neighbor, and all that, frequently suffer persecution, while the wicked prosper in this life - in other words, much like our world. God (or any other deity) isn't particularly ACTIVE in the world, but the idea that "power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely" is not a truism so much as a cynical outlook espoused by jaded intellectuals and agnostic philosophers. Those who are true and faithful followers of their respective faiths are frequently shocked and appalled at the atrocities perpetrated by those who would use religion - or patriotism - as a veil of respectability, dragging the reputations of those followers who don't subscribe to the more violent and hateful "creeds" espoused by the powerful through the mud and grime, but those peaceful and righteous followers are hard-pressed to overcome the whims of the powerful who claim to speak in the name of God or patriotism or what have you. The corruption encountered in the World of Darkness isn't on a cosmological level, but instead on a much more personal level - free will allows for many decisions, and all too many choose the easier, more expedient path.

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In run it pretty Biblical in an mix between the Christian Catholic and the Jewish Kabbalistic cosmologies. Now there are many things that exist that you wouldn't find in the Bible but in all there is a guy called God at the top and a guy called Lucifer at the bottom, and a whole load of stuff in between. This does not mean that any special part of Christianity or Judaism holds the absolute truth but that's the general stuff.

But then again my World of Darkness is mostly grey as opposed to pitch-black. There are alot of villains but most of them are grey, even if a darker shade of grey, characters but with good and bad qualities. I would say that most of those who can be defined as villains are simply in a position or situation where their bad qualities gets more oppertunity to express themselves than their god qualities, this goes for both mundane and supernatural alike.

As you can probably tell I'm mostly into vampires and I have not yet found an exact way to fit the others into the cosmology but I am sure that in time I will.

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